Mini-Sites … Time to Grow Up
By Alan on Mar 31, 2009 in Mini Sites
There has been some decent discussion about the value of Mini-Sites on a recent post at Domain Name Wire however I really want to challenge all the mini-site providers to step up to the game.
First, I want to say I commend all those who are providing mini-sites to people.
Basically, kudos for doing something while others do nothing however is the product actually worth the money? Some people agree with me, others don’t and some never say a word. Let’s get this straight – for the record I do not really care what anybody thinks personally about my opinions but I do care about the industry and how we look to end users, new investors and main street.
In 1999 I purchased some html software (hotdog) and started learning FrontPage and basically learned within a couple weeks all the code one would ever need to make what people are calling mini-sites today. It’s not hard and no one is reinventing the wheel with these products. Granted, my knowledge of programming, online marketing and development is probably far greater then many however it doesn’t mean we will not take advantage of new offerings in this industry even in the most basic formats such as mini-sites, if they are worthwhile.
There are many sides to the Mini-Site product.
Some say there are useless, others say they generate millions from having 1,000’s of these sites while others claim it’s a worthy investment for newbies.
Where am I?
First and foremost I believe they are sort of useless in their current formats but instead of ranting about why lets use facts
Most mini-sites look the same – AEIOU’s designs (are they not all the same … why not just copy the source code and insert your own images)
Original content – if produced in mass volumes how original can all the content be coming from the same writers? Believe me when I say Google penalizes for duplicate content across sites and although I’m certainly not claiming that anyone is not providing original content I do know the same 5 or 10 people who write content will eventually have things overlap. Domain owners need to write their own content – by doing so, you learn more about the industry and in turn, empower yourself as a domain owner even more.
Gateway to Laziness – I’ve said this a few times about mini-sites. Domain owners many times look at now what’s become a semi-pretty site and move on to the next since why would Google not want to rank your site high – After all, it looks so good. Have 500 domains … time to get moving and that mini-site that was put up yesterday will more often than not stay that way.
Enough points about what’s wrong. Just as people continue to pay $35 at network solutions for a domain people will still buy these mini-sites day after day so again, kudos to those who have the patience and dedication to provide such a product (and deal with customer service for margins so low – percentage wise they may be high but believe me how many designers will tell you working with clients that want to pay $200 is far worse than dealing with someone who pays you $5,000)
Now, For the challenge to mini-site providers
Do not take these words as offensive as the point is far greater than a simple criticism of your efforts to provide a product to domain owners but a challenge, an opportunity and an experienced opnion on how you can become better than all the rest overnight.
Why not step up to the plate and provide template(s) that empower the domain owners to build out networks for their industry targeted domains, provide widget power to help owners add functionality as they go or even forgo the html templates so commonly associated with mini-sites for custom wordpress themes where the owner has the power.
You see – a business plan for all the mini-site providers is the same across the board from what I see. Sell as many as you can for the one time fee and maybe hook a few clients for SEO marketing upon completion.
Hold up …. SEO tools are 10 times better with templates that offer plug-in compatibility and are poised to grow with the web so isn’t your business model failing even the simple fact of giving your clients a better product to prove your own SEO skills with.
It’s almost like the gold was seen by calculating the number of sites one could do in a week multiplied by how many clients and that’s it – that’s the plan.
SO much opportunity exists in the mini-site arena but the products need to exist. In a world of widgets, plug-ins and templates there should be an incredible product for domain owners born within a week of someone taking this article seriously and not focus on defending the mini-site industry in its current form.
Again, I’m for people doing well but also want product offerings to become representative of today’s tools – not new ones that are simply duplicates of work provided by others. In fact, why would you as a company owner want that? You can do more and you know it.
The best wordpress themes cost $300 max.
Custom designs range from $1,500 to $5,000 or more but these are end-user costs. Providers can build this for free and shit, built the greatest templates for SEO and mini-site building and charge the same mini-site fee ($2 or $300) – your money will still be tenfold of that one time customer who buys a custom theme.
Staying power is for those companies that build for the future not build for a few dollars today.
So, its not criticism here but a challenge – a challenge to providers to build products of value which use the tools of today and represent the power to expand tomorrow.
It would be great to hear from domain owners and mini-site providers about this since I truly want our generation of domainers to look less like spam and empower domain owners everywhere to have the tools to build businesses, not just a website.
Thoughts, criticism and even the odd curse is always welcome 
mike | Mar 31, 2009 | Reply
Great post, couldn’t agree with you more.
Better and quicker development across an entire channel is the future.
In my opinion, it’s hard to beat Wordpress.
DN Media | Mar 31, 2009 | Reply
I fail to see the logic behind your theory that mini sites breed laziness. Are you going to be more inspired to build upon a solid, attractive foundation that you spent your hard-earned money on, or to start from scratch yourself? It is so much easier to pick up where a mini site developer leaves off by adding more content and building additional backlinks than to start from nothing. The parking companies have caused complacency in this industry, not small-scale developers.
It is impossible to own thousands of domains that you continuously add content to and promote if you are a small operation or one-man show. The key is to pick the ones with the best earning potential (be it 5 or 50), and get them moving in the right direction. Once you have those chugging along, pick a few more and roll the extra earnings into further development. Looking at your entire portfolio and saying “I can’t afford to build them all out at once, so I won’t build any out” doesn’t make any sense. You have to start growing your business and your portfolio somewhere.
Both our solution and AEIOU offer sites based on WordPress, which allows you to add widgets, plugins, shopping carts, etc. There are WordPress add-ons for just about anything you could imagine. You are not getting five static pages that can never change or be improved upon, you’re getting the foundation and building blocks to take your site to the next level.
wannadevelop.com | Mar 31, 2009 | Reply
Nope… Wordpress is not the solution. It doesn’t work for domain mass development of 100s or 1000s of domains for various reasons.
As I’ve posted on my own site, in response to one of my readers inquiries on all the new mini sites services popping up.
Question: Any opinion on these other Mini Site companies popping up online. They doing it right?
Answer: regarding all of the other mini-site services — It would really be a waste of my time to give them a comprehensive review as they are all pretty much still missing the basics, but lets hope that they do continue to improve if they are serious about their business.
While I’ve been doing this for 7+ years going strong and working out techniques to make things work and staying on top of this when it comes to domain mass development they just got involved recently and think that just because they can install a wordpress blog and post up a few articles on it they have the solution to all the current problems — they don’t.
I feel bad for those people who order a dozen or 50 or 100+ wordpress blog mini-sites and don’t update them (system upgrades, patches, etc) Few month’s down the road when an Iranian or Turkish hacker owns their site (exploits) they will tear this mini-site operators a new asshole and sue them to hell (possibly) but that is the way it goes.
Need due dilligence
I can’t be here 24/7/365 reviewing all this mini-sites or warning other people… It’s their job to do the research and know what they are getting themselves involved with.
Originally posted at http://www.wannadevelop.com/observations/domain-name-traffic-arbitrage/
Alan | Mar 31, 2009 | Reply
Reggie,
For the record – I’m a big fan of what you do and how you see this industry far different than many. I know your theories work first hand and respect your insights more than most of what I read.
Many will think of this as a sales pitch but its not – if you are new and going to spend any money spend it with these guys wannadevelop.com
Alan | Mar 31, 2009 | Reply
I never claimed the theory of
“If you can’t afford to build them all out at once, so I won’t build any out”
You’re right – that does not make any sense.
However you have to admit that all mini-sites in their current formats seriously look like stepchildren of free wordpress themes.
I’m not trying to discount hard work (fuck it, maybe I am since I want a better product for mass development and there should be one by now) but even free wordpress templates look better than any mini-sites I have ever seen that are pumped by companies like AEIOU and others.
I could list a number of examples but I won’t put anyone’s specific website down. However, anybody reading this has to agree that ANY template on this page
http://www.elegantthemes.com/
is much better than any mini-site design that has yet to be offered by any leading “expert” designer of mini-sites.
And these guys charge $19.95 a YEAR for use of ALL templates.
Also, if you’re defining hard earned money as $200 or $300 for a mini-site then the people who classify this amount of money as a lot should, and usually do, look into all the options available at much lower price points to achieve their web building goals.
At some point, maybe a half dozen sites – they probably can’t afford to build anymore so building them out and picking out the best 10 or 15 to develop is almost a cost prohibitive process for anyone who doesn’t have a lot of money.
What if the first 10 don’t prove to be any more than a couple bucks a month revenue?
The owner who just invested what he considers to be a lot of money is deep in the red site after site until some – if any – ever hit big.
Sure, it’s a gamble- one that relies on the domain name and content itself (which is a whole other topic) but my challenge was that ALL providers can provide more.
At this time they simply choose not to.
It is not a question of cost or time. It’s a choice. Better solutions are there (for free) so build something better than what you can get for free and providers will earn much more love from the community and domain owners (who can write nice checks) but keep the status quo and this argument and the love/hate relationship will never change.
At the end of the day its about SEO and content and keyword domains more than anything else but when providers charge $300 for pages that look like simple designs of much lower quality than what you can get for free then honestly – sit back and honestly think about – what do you expect people to say?
miniBlogs | Mar 31, 2009 | Reply
I’m not new to Wordpress, or mini sites, I can hand code, SEO and have done since 2004.
I agree with many points being made from both sides of the coin and this is clearly not a simple black or white issue.
wannadevelop, you say “I feel bad for those people who order a dozen or 50 or 100+ wordpress blog mini-sites and don’t update them (system upgrades, patches, etc) Few month’s down the road when an Iranian or Turkish hacker owns their site (exploits) they will tear this mini-site operators a new asshole and sue them to hell (possibly) but that is the way it goes.”
I’ve been building wordpress blogs for 3 years now and NEVER had one exploited or hacked. That’s stirring fear about WP even though hacks do happen. But to say “Few months’ down the road…” is just incorrect. Also, you don’t HAVE to update Wordpress, it’s recommended just like going from HTML 4 to XHTML. It’s recommended. And yes, Wordpress can work VERY well for 1000s of domains.
Wordpress allows non-techy types to login, add content, fully customize their site, create SEO ready pages, add plugins, WIHOUT the need to go back to the developer and incur further costs due to huge hourly modification sessions. Whether you have a wordpress blog or a “mini site” made from html/css, I feel sorry for those who don’t update ANY type of site. Wordpress makes updating very easy.
Alan, I agree that it would be nice to see more attractive themes. I offer a blog building service (mini BLOGS not SITES) and I use mainly themes from WooThemes but also RevolutionTwo (now StudioPress) and ElegantThemes among others. Why? Because I appreciate design. Will it make your site rank better or earn you more money? Not necessarily, but it will add value to an otherwise parked domain or some simple looking css/html site or free WP theme.
Also Alan, you promote wannadevelop and I’m sure he/they are experts in their field, but from what I’ve seen they build sites at around $100/pop and you then advocate asking for developers to “build something better than what you can get for free and providers will earn much more love from the community and domain owners”.
Maybe I’m being pedantic but to build something “better than free” is to not only build it for free, but to incur costs until the domain owner makes a profit effectively, offering a free service? Please help me understand your argument with that comment.
What I think people forget is a) some domainers value time over money and would prefer to pay someone to develop a few sites since to do it themselves would be too time consuming and b) developers who have spent years learning the ropes to deliver a quality theme, make each theme SEO ready, offer advice if needed, add quality cotnent, offering loads of extras (not free, like hosting) then these skills and services must be paid for.
What exactly do domainers want? A free installation, free SEO work, free backlinks, and if, and only if, they make a profit they’ll then pay? I know that’s a silly set of questions but I’d like to know more what domainers want so I can offer better services. I’m not new to building sites but I’ve only just started offering my services to the public. But, they won’t be free. Wannadevelop and DN Media don’t offer free services. Gotta ask yourself why mate.
Scott
wannadevelop.com | Mar 31, 2009 | Reply
I don’t want to single out anybody… But all of the mini sites builders / mass development services out there totally miss the mark when it comes to SEO. Even the basics aren’t included. It’s too bad.
Hackers exploit servers where they find multiple sites setup on outdated CMS.
Guess which servers they are going to hack and put forward their focus and most of their energy.. A server that has 10 shitty sites.. Or 100s and 1000s of sites setup on generic domains?
BTW, hackers own up sites all the time and it goes unnoticed. They plug in little links and javascript codes here and there.
Some do deface websites… But what I am saying is that most domainers will never update their sites and the fear should be real.
It is pointless setting them up in wordpress or any other CMS either way.
When blogs where hot.. I was all over it. When RSS scrapping and manipulating those feeds for SEO was hot.. I was all over it.
All this people now popping up are a few years too late to the party. It’s old news. Time to brainstorm some more or copy somebody who at least knows what they are doing and is successful.
How hard is this stuff to figure out!?
I tell ya…
Alan | Mar 31, 2009 | Reply
Scott,
Thank You.
These comments I love since they pose questions that ask more of the topic presented than simply beating the same tree over and over.
With reference to your comment
“Maybe I’m being pedantic but to build something “better than free” is to not only build it for free, but to incur costs until the domain owner makes a profit effectively, offering a free service? Please help me understand your argument with that comment”
I’m not saying offer a free service but when charging money for mini-sites I think the progression should be towards someone actually building an easy to use program (such as affiliatetheme) but much more advanced. The only cost for someone knowledgable about code really is time and that is free. Once its built in a way that can be scaled for mass development and addresses both the design, functionality and scaleability then sell it for $300, $400 or $500 or more.
The math in me states that most people will only buy a few mini-sites anyway and realize its quite an easy process but sell a software piece and you can not only sell add-ons, upgrades and more but you also build something unique which no one has yet to offer on any kind of decent basis.
So free – no, but building it is basically your time and maybe thats free – maybe its not – but the financial investment is relatively nothing at all.
As for wannadevelop. If someone is going to spend money on a site then I’m a big fan of the theory wanndevelop.com uses. His comments above – quite frankly, have no idea about what he was really saying, looks like just a copy and paste from another article on his own site but my point in somewhat promoting his services was that “IF” someone is going to spend the money then its a much better idea to use and learn from someone who truly is a damn good SEO person and understands keyword SEO and keyword domains much more than most people I see blogging. His blog is hard to read (yes, the big text is a killer) but again “IF” somebody is going to spend money on creating a site he seems to do a lot of stuff different (and better IMO) than the AEIOU’S of the world.
I would love to see another offering on the table but if you’re going to build the same mini-sites currently available then maybe I will beat you up the same way
)
I know the issue is not black and white at all but I know there are much better solutions just waiting for someone to build.
And its just not me – we need to bring the 2 sides of this together and the company that does will gain the quickest.
Enrico S. | Mar 31, 2009 | Reply
“At the end of the day its about SEO and content and keyword domains” The dilemma of course is how to build out domains with quality web sites en masse. Of course, the answer is you can’t. But for a certain number of your best domains, you need to invest real time and money. And the key to page one search results is A+ content. How to get the top experts in any field to blog for you? http://www.vertio.net offers you own private labeled radio station. Interview tony hawk if you sell skateboards. People will link to you or post the link-back widget on their web site. If you are selling ear muffs, interview the guy who climbed Mount Everest with a pair of ear muffs on. There are no real shortcuts here. You need to earn your way to page 1…..
wannadevelop.com | Mar 31, 2009 | Reply
Alan, to clarify.. My comment was an answer to Scott but didn’t mention it.. Oops.
domainers + wordpress x 100s of domains = trouble
miniBlogs | Mar 31, 2009 | Reply
Alan, I too find these discussions interesting. I know what you mean about finding a better solution and I completely agree.
Wannadevelop, I’ve only just found your site and find your articles an interesting read. I still say your negative comments about Wordpress aren’t backed up by any concrete examples. Nothing personal but it’s easy to brow beat others (ie CMS, WP, etc.) yet it would be even more convincing if you provided more info to backup why your “system” is even better. You must create some rock-solid, unhackable sites.
SEO is not rocket science yet you can say there is an “art” to it.
When blogs were hot and then scraping? Yes, populating blogs with RSS2Blog type programs or scraping with some php script is old (black) hat, so 2006! So are you saying you’ve tried those backdoor routines and they don’t work anymore? Of course they don’t and that’s what I see now a days with a lot of sites, crappy RSS feeds populating blogs because people are lazy and want high returns with little effort. Enough to say WP is “trouble”? lol Funny.
I’m not saying WP is the ONLY way to go but to say trouble is purely incorrect! So, I won’t go on anymore about WP or any CMS because it becomes some subjective “who’s opinion is right” contest.
I know my blogs rank, earn, and do quite well for me and my clients and that makes me feel like I provide a good service. Do I have lots to learn? Sure, we all do. That’s partly why I’m interested in these discussions, to learn more about what people want and to provide something above and beyond what most offer. I build according to what I know works, therefore if it works for me, I offer it to people.
Anyway, I enjoy this site, and yours wannadevelop even if I don’t agree with all you say.
Anony | Mar 31, 2009 | Reply
Alan, just because someone claims to be God’s gift to SEO doesn’t make it so. Please do research before being taken in by these guys.
wannadevelop.com: “I don’t want to single out anybody… But all of the mini sites builders / mass development services out there totally miss the mark when it comes to SEO. Even the basics aren’t included. It’s too bad.”
Except for you, right? Give me a break!
Scott | Apr 1, 2009 | Reply
If people have many domains of course they are looking for a low cost model to develop their names. There are many good domains out there as there are many bad domains.
I have used free css templates and although they don’t look the best sites around, they certainly are better than parked and they earn more as well.
I think the biggest problem is that people need to spend time maintaining their sites after the initial development.
Are we all sitting for the next big thing to come by and jump on??
Mark | Apr 1, 2009 | Reply
Any opinions on XSite Pro or Joomla?
Thanks.
AGG | Apr 1, 2009 | Reply
Ask yourself one question.
Why are people/companies that own undeveloped/parked domains offering mini-site development for others?
I know. Because people that own domains who have no idea how to make a website are suckers! Or they are just lazy!
If there services/mini-sites are so amazing then why are they wasting their time doing it for others. Trust me, it is not because they like helping others.
Alan | Apr 1, 2009 | Reply
Anony,
Thanks for the comments. Only reason I mentioned wannadevelop mainly was that he is doing something different than the rest – for the record, everybody claims to be God’s gift to SEO so whether someone makes that claim or not it does influence my decision to say try someone else. I rarely get wrapped up in anything I read online and these guys are no exception but I do think their public display of SEO knowledge from various articles I have read is far superior to many – but again it’s just my opinion.
————————
Mark,
No opinions on these – sorry – we tried xSite once but it wasn’t for us – some like it, just have no say either way
————————
Scott,
That’s half the problem – I think many domain owners simply have no idea what to do and waiting for someone to tell them is the only possible next step they see so yes, many are just waiting for someone to announce the next big thing. Like any industry, there are more followers than leaders.
————————
AGG,
I think there are suckers in every aspect of any industry. Whether it’s the person who pays 4 points for a mortgage loan, doesn’t question the $495 processing fees when buying a new car or paying $35 at Network Solutions for a domain.
One of my main issues with mini-site providers (in their CURRENT form) is they don’t seem to challenge themselves to look better than what’s available for free. In fact, they spend more time trying to justify the cost by defining the time, work etc when they could spend that time creating more options or at the very least …
MORE EXAMPLES OF QUALITY WORK on their websites.
Judge a book by its cover – and when buying a mini-site, when choosing a designer the ONLY real way to judge an initial purchase is to see their work in action.
Most of AEIOU’s case studies all look the same. The very first showcased site for minisites.com is Rockford.com – a spammy looking site that does not indicate any correlation of being a wordpress site or indicative of any real talent for design. With that said the next two get better (and I will give credit when credit is due) vintagewines.com is a pretty good mini-site but also none of these sites showcase any kind of “wordpress power” which was claimed above so for those who know design, understand wordpress and even beginners who have searched different designs and are now looking for some help the examples showcased DO NOT show the kind of skill that people are selling. Its not to say they don’t have it – just not showcasing it the right way.
Again, its constructive criticism – like it or not – but if you want more support from the domain community than showcase more, bigger and better projects – even if they are your own domains – doesn’t matter, we want to see your work so we can make a decision based on that. Show me your best 4 sites (which happen to all look the same) and you quickly get blacklisted from getting any respect as a custom designer.
Now, there is an obvious value to providing this service to some but in order to get industry wide support why not think and create templates or sites that MOST domain owners would want – unless that’s not your target market?
If not, then who cares and ignore all of us who may say what you don’t want to hear but I can honestly say that if tables were turned many mini-site providers (if they were smart) would not buy their own mini-sites (in their CURRENT form .. say again .. in thier CURRENT form) if they were simply domain owners and not providers. Of course, one will never know the real answer to this question but that’s my guess.
Where is the answer?
Not sure, but we will find out when people come together and make someone rich but its not today. The door to riches is open … and waiting for someone to walk in.
AGG | Apr 1, 2009 | Reply
Well said!
wannadevelop.com | Apr 7, 2009 | Reply
http://domainnamewire.com/2009/04/07/a-long-morning-thanks-to-wordpress-hack/comment-page-1/
I rest my case.